From analogue-request@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu Tue May 4 12:50:13 1993 Received: by quark.magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (5.65/3.910213) id AA14724; Tue, 4 May 93 12:47:50 -0400 Errors-To: analogue-request@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu Sender: analogue-request@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu Received: from nkosi.well.sf.ca.us by quark.magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (5.65/3.910213) id AA14719; Tue, 4 May 93 12:47:48 -0400 Received: from well.sf.ca.us by nkosi.well.sf.ca.us with SMTP id AA29730 (5.65c/IDA-1.5 for ); Tue, 4 May 1993 09:47:37 -0700 Received: by well.sf.ca.us (5.65c/SMI-4.1/well-930413-1) id AA10336; Tue, 4 May 1993 09:47:23 -0700 Date: Tue, 4 May 1993 09:47:23 -0700 From: Chris Meyer Message-Id: <199305041647.AA10336@well.sf.ca.us> To: analogue@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu, ricard@axis.se, till@lucid.com Subject: Re: Ring Modulator Status: OR Talking to a fanatic I know, he claims there were no sonic diffs between the white Odyssey and the the first black one. The difference between the grey 2600 and the orange-detailed one was mainly the filter - now 24dB/octave. There was a rumor awhile back that Arp ripped off Moog's filter design down the road and tried to conceal it by sealing the module in epoxy "for temperature stability." When someone here mentioned an epoxy-sealed filter, I began to wonder... But thanks for the tip on what the rind mod in the Od really was - I had used one briefly, and wondered why the ring mod sounded so diff than the module in my PAiA... - CM From analogue-request@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu Mon May 3 11:38:11 1993 Received: by quark.magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (5.65/3.910213) id AA13356; Mon, 3 May 93 11:34:00 -0400 Errors-To: analogue-request@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu Sender: analogue-request@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu Received: from acid-rain.lucid.com by quark.magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (5.65/3.910213) id AA13345; Mon, 3 May 93 11:33:57 -0400 Received: by acid-rain.lucid.com (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA28205; Mon, 3 May 93 08:33:53 PDT Date: Mon, 3 May 93 08:33:53 PDT From: till@lucid.com (Don Tillman) Message-Id: <9305031533.AA28205@acid-rain.lucid.com> To: analogue@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu In-Reply-To: Ricard Wolf's message of Mon, 3 May 93 15:06:04 MET DST Subject: Ring Modulator Reply-To: till@lucid.com Status: OR From: ricard@axis.se (Ricard Wolf) Date: Mon, 3 May 93 15:06:04 MET DST > That said, now for the weird thing: the Odyssey ring modulator, while > effectively an exclusive or gate, is implemented pretty wastefully. 2 > nand gates, a couple diodes, a transistor, 8 resistors. I have no idea > what they were thinking. It could easily have been half a quad xor gate, > with the other half serving a useful purpose in the VCOs. [I obviously meant to say "one-quarter of a quad ex-xor gate"] [And while I'm correcting myself, in the previous discussion when I said that there are no opamps in the Odyssey's audio path, I wasn't considering the VCF, which is a sealed module that I haven't open up, and it may or may not have opamps in its audio path.] Hm. Weird. Perhaps the remaining two nand gates (I assume it's a 4011 or somesuch) are used elsewhere, but they couldn't find reasonable use for XOR gates? So a couple of diodes, a transistor and 8 resistors were cheaper than an XOR gate chip (4070? 4071? can't remember). Or, at least, perhaps they were when they started manufacturing the Odessey. The two remaining nands are used as inverters, buffering the square wave outputs for the VCOs, so unless 4070s were real expensive at the time, there's really no excuse for this. (And it's that way on both the Odyssey and Odyssey II.) Okay, so the Odyssey isn't the most elegant piece of engineering ever, it's still pretty cool. -- Don From analogue-request@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu Mon May 3 10:35:41 1993 Received: by quark.magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (5.65/3.910213) id AA10193; Mon, 3 May 93 10:32:22 -0400 Errors-To: analogue-request@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu Sender: analogue-request@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu Received: from nic.lth.se by quark.magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (5.65/3.910213) id AA10181; Mon, 3 May 93 10:32:20 -0400 Received: from axisab.axis.se by mail.lth.se with bsmtp (Smail3.1.28.1 #2) id m0nq1Yy-000MTyC; Mon, 3 May 93 16:32 MET DST Received: by axisab.axis.se (/\==/\ Smail3.1.25.1 #25.6) id ; Mon, 3 May 93 15:06 MET DST Message-Id: From: ricard@axis.se (Ricard Wolf) Date: Mon, 3 May 93 15:06:04 MET DST X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.0.1 12/13/89) To: till@lucid.com, analogue@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Ring Modulator Status: OR > That said, now for the weird thing: the Odyssey ring modulator, while > effectively an exclusive or gate, is implemented pretty wastefully. 2 > nand gates, a couple diodes, a transistor, 8 resistors. I have no idea > what they were thinking. It could easily have been half a quad xor gate, > with the other half serving a useful purpose in the VCOs. Hm. Weird. Perhaps the remaining two nand gates (I assume it's a 4011 or somesuch) are used elsewhere, but they couldn't find reasonable use for XOR gates? So a couple of diodes, a transistor and 8 resistors were cheaper than an XOR gate chip (4070? 4071? can't remember). Or, at least, perhaps they were when they started manufacturing the Odessey. They're not using any weird circuit quirks are they? I've seen people use CMOS inverters as low-budget inverting opamps for instance... /Ricard -- Ricard Wolf / | \ / | /- email: ricard@axis.se Axis Communications AB /__| \/ | \__ uucp: axisab.se!ricard S - 223 70 LUND / | /\ | \ Tel: +46 46 19 18 63 SWEDEN / | / \ | \__/ Fax: +46 46 13 61 30 -- "Many choices many voices keep on telling me - It's you Evelyn, it's you" -- From analogue-request@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu Tue May 4 05:46:45 1993 Received: by quark.magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (5.65/3.910213) id AA26857; Tue, 4 May 93 05:45:56 -0400 Errors-To: analogue-request@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu Sender: analogue-request@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu Received: from nic.lth.se by quark.magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (5.65/3.910213) id AA26852; Tue, 4 May 93 05:45:55 -0400 Received: from axisab.axis.se by mail.lth.se with bsmtp (Smail3.1.28.1 #2) id m0nqJZM-000MUHC; Tue, 4 May 93 11:45 MET DST Received: by axisab.axis.se (/\==/\ Smail3.1.25.1 #25.6) id ; Tue, 4 May 93 11:44 MET DST Message-Id: From: ricard@axis.se (Ricard Wolf) Date: Tue, 4 May 93 11:44:28 MET DST X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.0.1 12/13/89) To: till@lucid.com, analogue@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Ring Modulator Status: OR > From: ricard@axis.se (Ricard Wolf) > Date: Tue, 4 May 93 09:00:59 MET DST > > What is the difference between the Odyssey and Odyssey II? > > I don't have all the details, but I'll do the best I can... > > There were five seperate Odysseys: the Odyssey (model 2800), and the > Odyssey II's (models 2810, 2811, 2812, and 2813). Some of the differences > between them include the front panel color, the mechanicals of the box, the > pitch bend (knob vs. pressure pads) the keyboard implementation (three bus > vs. two bus), and the circuitry changed in subtle ways between the I and > the II (probably the most significant change would be some improvements to > the VCOs). > > I don't know if any of these changes were audible. > > -- Don Interesting! I'll have to check the model number on mine... Any idea of which models were white/black etc? /Ricard -- Ricard Wolf / | \ / | /- email: ricard@axis.se Axis Communications AB /__| \/ | \__ uucp: axisab.se!ricard S - 223 70 LUND / | /\ | \ Tel: +46 46 19 18 63 SWEDEN / | / \ | \__/ Fax: +46 46 13 61 30 -- "Watch them all fall down -- Domino Dancing" -- From analogue-request@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu Tue May 4 03:53:17 1993 Received: by quark.magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (5.65/3.910213) id AA25324; Tue, 4 May 93 03:52:25 -0400 Errors-To: analogue-request@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu Sender: analogue-request@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu Received: from acid-rain.lucid.com by quark.magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (5.65/3.910213) id AA25319; Tue, 4 May 93 03:52:19 -0400 Received: by acid-rain.lucid.com (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA29135; Tue, 4 May 93 00:52:16 PDT Date: Tue, 4 May 93 00:52:16 PDT From: till@lucid.com (Don Tillman) Message-Id: <9305040752.AA29135@acid-rain.lucid.com> To: analogue@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu In-Reply-To: Ricard Wolf's message of Tue, 4 May 93 09:00:59 MET DST Subject: Ring Modulator Reply-To: till@lucid.com Status: OR From: ricard@axis.se (Ricard Wolf) Date: Tue, 4 May 93 09:00:59 MET DST What is the difference between the Odyssey and Odyssey II? I don't have all the details, but I'll do the best I can... There were five seperate Odysseys: the Odyssey (model 2800), and the Odyssey II's (models 2810, 2811, 2812, and 2813). Some of the differences between them include the front panel color, the mechanicals of the box, the pitch bend (knob vs. pressure pads) the keyboard implementation (three bus vs. two bus), and the circuitry changed in subtle ways between the I and the II (probably the most significant change would be some improvements to the VCOs). I don't know if any of these changes were audible. -- Don